charcoal requirements
I've watched the videos on making charcoal. Q. Is there a point of conversion that works best for gasifiers before reaching the completed stages of making charcoal. Would it be dependent on total moisture content or other factors such as tar content etc.?
Replies to This Discussion
-
Permalink Reply by Steve Unruh on -
Hi Paul
I was hoping you would join up.
Good Question. I would have thought the dryer, the purer the better. Then a while back I read a paper called The Making of the Kalle Gasifier. Dr Torsten Kalle developed improvements to his New car with a charcoal gasifier back in 1941/42. After this experience he states quite clearly instead of a perfect/pure charcoal it is the responsibility of the gasifier designer to make his system work well with varying fuel qualities.
If you have never read this you can find a downloadable copy here in the LINKs page here. Left hand side of the MAIN page.
Link to the gasifiers.bioenergylists site.
on the R.H. side in the page open up "Fuels"
next page on the L.H. side open up "Charcoal"
The downloadable article is halfway down the page.
A whole new world of information will open up for you.
Regards
SteveU.
-
Permalink Reply by Paul Drieman on -
Hi Steve,
Thank you for the information and web site link! It seems reasonable so many running vehicles on wood gas must know a few things about how it's done! God Bless and I'll get pictures up as the project developes.
-
Permalink Reply by Paul Drieman on
-
Am I thankful you took careful steps to guide me through the huge lists of possible accesses. I'm reading the article for a third time now trying to imagine what Kalle' was seeing when he developed these answers to problems he faced. Thanks again! Paul note: the thought of 3000 Km trouble free driving is very appealing. That's like 400 trips into town for me!
-
Permalink Reply by john wayne blount on -
Paul,
Here's a youtube link to a guy in Brazil who is running his Fiat pickup on a cross-draft charcoal unit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nzl5zHlVth4
Cross-drafts are usually considered too "dirty" for vehicle use, but with charcoal fuel those problems seem to be avoided. There are some extremely high temperatures to design around though.
John
Paul Drieman said:Am I thankful you took careful steps to guide me through the huge lists of possible accesses. I'm reading the article for a third time now trying to imagine what Kalle' was seeing when he developed these answers to problems he faced. Thanks again! Paul note: the thought of 3000 Km trouble free driving is very appealing. That's like 400 trips into town for me!
-
Permalink Reply by Paul Drieman on
-
Happy New Years John and all!
Thanks for the youtube link. Maybe we all can get renewed in the excitement of helping each other accomplish goals of self-suffiency. I confess life has gotten in my way and now like Napoleon and Hitler attacking Russia; winter has hit us with near zero temps/snow and my shop is UN-heated. I appreciate those ideas that are under private developement...why not make a living from great ideas. I fell in love with the concept of supporting the success of the beginner; I still am. I am thinking of converting a 500gal propane tank into a charcoal converter. I wonder how much charcoal that would be? Hmmm
-
Permalink Reply by john wayne blount on
-
Paul,
With a 500 gallon tank I'm wondering what your wood source would be, haha. I do remember seeing a set-up some guy had with two 55 gal drums side by side with plumbing for the pyrolysis gasses to burn underneath them. The whole thing was encased in a concrete block wall. If done on a daily basis it should be easy enough to maintain a constant supply of charcoal for whatever gasification needs you would have. Just remember that the "flow" starts with the collection of the fuel, so if that means trips out into the cold wet woods to get your fuel it has to be part of your equations. Good side of that is that wet wood should not pose a problem. It might be worthwhile to investigate just how complete a conversion to charcoal is really necessary cause some folks are saying partially torrified wood works really great. Don't really know if one could even regulate that with a charcoal producing system or not.
Damn! Just ain't nothing free these days!
One interesting part of the charcoal idea is that it would be a "standard" fuel and one wouldn't have to freak out over re-tweaking his unit for a new fuel found down the road.
Feel for you guys up north in the cold. Spring is on it's way though.
John
Paul Drieman said:Happy New Years John and all!
Thanks for the youtube link. Maybe we all can get renewed in the excitement of helping each other accomplish goals of self-suffiency. I confess life has gotten in my way and now like Napoleon and Hitler attacking Russia; winter has hit us with near zero temps/snow and my shop is UN-heated. I appreciate those ideas that are under private developement...why not make a living from great ideas. I fell in love with the concept of supporting the success of the beginner; I still am. I am thinking of converting a 500gal propane tank into a charcoal converter. I wonder how much charcoal that would be? Hmmm
-
Permalink Reply by Paul Drieman on
-
Hey John!
I agree to the partial stage. My thoughts are having a means to "dry" the supply and that could be accomplished by measuring the "time" of the burn under the supply and monitoring the steam to gas change-over. One would merely chase the water content out and keep the burnable gases in the wood eliminating the condesate problems.
-
Permalink Reply by Steve Unruh on
-
Hm-m-m
Paul, John, as I understand it torrification is the heat conditioning/stabilizing of the surface of the wood fuel particles. Like "browning", "searing" a piece of meat.
I think only a more or less fully pyrolizing of the wood particles will produce the combustible gases to produce the heat to be able to claim a self energy sustaining system. Starting up heat can always be supplied by fully combusted wood fuels and that flame later supplemented or replaced by the flaming combusted pyrolization gases and tars.
To merely dry the wood fuel where do you propose to get the heat?
Regards
SteveU.
-
Permalink Reply by john wayne blount on
-
Steve,
Torrification can be more than just surface charring. Most torrification systems use the heat from the exit gasses of the gasifier itself, and I guess one can choose how far to go with it. Dark roast coffee or light roast. Charcoal is the end product.
Sounds like you're speaking from some real world experience about the energy needs to do this.
There's always a trade-off somewhere. In the pellet and briquette market the loss of the pyrolysis gasses to make a torrified product are way more than offset by the cheaper shipping, handling, water resistance, longer die lives of the pellletizers, etc. etc. Just what the trade-off would be on a "make my own charcoal" system I'm not that sure. Danillo in Brazil finds it well within his acceptable scope of work. Otherwise he'd be trying to build a gasifier that would burn straight coffee tree trimmings.
Do we have any charoal burning gasifiers running the roads here in the states?
John
Steve Unruh said:Hm-m-m
Paul, John, as I understand it torrification is the heat conditioning/stabilizing of the surface of the wood fuel particles. Like "browning", "searing" a piece of meat.
I think only a more or less fully pyrolizing of the wood particles will produce the combustible gases to produce the heat to be able to claim a self energy sustaining system. Starting up heat can always be supplied by fully combusted wood fuels and that flame later supplemented or replaced by the flaming combusted pyrolization gases and tars.
To merely dry the wood fuel where do you propose to get the heat?
Regards
SteveU.
-
Permalink Reply by Paul Drieman on
-
Hi Steve,
My thoughts are having a supply of wood in the preparation chamber and burning the trash that seems to accumulate under the chamber every time I need to burn a trash fire. It will be a "storage container" to keep the prepared wood as any moisture driven out will be that much I won't have to deal with later.I'll work out a remove and replace wood in the container method so I rotate the oldest and dryest and dry the wettest over the hottest part of the fire.
Welcome to
Victory Gasworks- Gasifiers and Wood Gasification
© 2010 Created by ben.
